Chaotic Abyss for Neverwinter Nights 2 Development and Steering

[perk31]

The purpose of this thread will be to discuss the development of Chaotic Abyss for Neverwinter Nights 2.  Anything is open so long as it involves this particular topic.

Of particular interest are the following items:

1.  What do you like about the current module that should remain unchanged.
2.  What you disklike about the current module that should be changed or removed.
3.  What makes a Persistent World enjoyable and keeps you coming back for more.
4.  Key elements you feel should be in a role playing server.
5.  Key elements you feel should be in an action oriented hak-n-slash server.

[perk31]

I think we should stick to the background we have already made, although I would not mind doing a mod based on the middle ages.  Our current background is wide open and sufficiently broad to allow a limitless number of plot lines without stepping on "established history".  Of course basing one on Forgotten Realms would have the advantage of player recognition.

I also think our area development should be much more focused this time.  I know my development was all over the place, based upon what I was trying to learn at the moment.  This time I think the focus should be on completing areas and integrating quests into those areas.  (a list of possible quests should be started under development).

[perk31]

I'd also like to have some type of jail system in the next mod.  I've played around with it some but haven't come up with anything I really like.  The biggest problem with jail is players bailing out because they don't want to wait.  I would think 2 minutes for pickpocket, assuming obsidian fixes that ridiculous system, 5 for theft, and 10 for murder.  Hopefully NWN2 will include some of Jasperre's AI improvements which would help the guards act like they should.

I also like the idea of building reputation into everything.  We could start a players rep at 50 and adjust based on actions and even how they treat NPCs.  We might be able to use some of the current reputation system.  Since nwn2 will go to level 20 I think we should consider level 10 and above to be epic for this purpose.  Below 10 reputation adjustments would be minor due to the players anonymity, but after 10 greater changes would be made since they will be well known by then.

[Podilarius]

I also think that since NWN2 will only go to level 20 ... players at level 10 and above should loose a level when they die. In the current mod I think 10 also but perk thinks 20 ... and 20 isn't so bad ...

[perk31]

I agree with loosing a level.  It will keep people from repeatedly attacking an impossible target immediately after gaining a level until they get the treasure drop.  We see a lot of that on the current mod but early players were against loosing a level.  I think 9 levels will be enough to learn the module.  I'm not sure multiple level loss should be possible though.  For instance, you die at level 11 and 20 minutes later you die again putting you back to level 9.  Unfortunately anyone willing to die twice with that setup would then be able to kill anyone they wanted, assuming they could get back to the target before they regenerated which is not very likely.

[Podilarius]

if they are dumb enough to try that ... then they should loose that 2nd level also ... that will teach em

[perk31]

if they are dumb enough to try that ... then they should loose that 2nd level also ... that will teach em

It is not about being dumb but about running into a situation you can't get out of.  I've been killed a few times on CA and I know every trap and monster.  Inevitably someone is going to be killed in one area and a few minutes later killed in a completely different area.  I'm just not sure that loosing multiple levels would not detract from the game play.

[Podilarius]

if you die the first time there ... then it is dumb to go try again just after you have died there ... logic has it that you just might die there again ...especially now that you have lost a level. Remember that when you die you are resurected in the same place, and we are only going to take the level if you respawn. If you are resurected, then a loss of level is not necessary. We where not afforded that luxury in AA ... but I see no reason to make them loose a level if they are resurected. Do you? Just hope you have a friend there with a scroll and he don't die either...

[perk31]

I specifically said two different areas.  If you run back and get killed in the same area back to back then dumb is definitely the word of the day.  Speaking of being killed, my thief was killed in the north coast pirate hold last night.  The spawner is pretty cool but it might be tougher than I intended.  I really need to try it with my Sorc if I can get him out of that loop.

Fighting here is quite different from AA and its much easier to get into something you can not extract yourself from and the baddies have a tendency to chase you down.  I know I would hate to go try a new area, loose a level, and then try another new area and die again.  I think you should only be able to loose one level per session or one level until you gain a level.  So at 12 you would drop to 11 and you could not loose another level until you had reached 12 again.

[Podilarius]

I don't think it detracts from the game. I think it adds being careful into the mix. If you are going to try new areas ... then you had better have a friend with Greater sancturary and either resurection scrolls or is a cleric. My thinking is that by the time you are level 10 you know where things are and kinda how tough they are, and you have also made friends with whom you can party up to go have a look at these new areas with.
I also feel that we should limit parties from forming or adding to if they are more than 5 levels away. That would keep a level 15 guy getting to much XP from having a level 1 in the party who is just getting XP from being there and doing nothing. *and we wonder how you can go from level 1 to 15 so fast ...*
I would also venture to say that once someone looses a level they are going to get it back before they go to any new areas. I know I would ... I did in AA, but as far as game play ... there are some baddies in there that "chased" you as well. Also in AA you have to be very careful when you fight not to take to long because things are not "visual" and there is no running around in a room while your ring regens your life in case you ran out of heals. I have died in AA where I simply took to long and a door leading out closed at the most inconvient time. Heals are taken very seriously in AA so that you don't meet your maker, so should they be here as well. At least more than they are taken for now ... Only time I have used a heal or healed someone else was during the DM event. Otherwise I really don't need to use them ... that should not be the case. I feel that you should fall all the way back to 10 if you die enough. Perhaps partying, playing with clerics/res scrolls, and potions/medkits would become more important.

[perk31]

I agree with all of it in principle, especially limiting the party levels.  Heals and such are important here but their impact is limited because you can't loose a level.  Granted I don't want to earn 15k of xp again since xp slows down quite a bit on CA, but it isn't detrimental like loosing a level is.  I'm not sure that loosing more than one level adds anything to the game play though,. granted you couldn't go past 10.  I don't really care but I'm sure you can expect some grief from players.

[Podilarius]

IMO it adds caution to the game ... managing what you want to do with your ability to accomplish it and what you need to accomplish it. It adds complexity and thought to the game ...

[Drakaen]

I feel i must bring this up as it has just came to my attention.

NWN2 currently will not be supported by the linux operating system. when they will have support for it is unknown as they have yet to realese a date on it.


thought i would bring that to the table


thanks,
Drakaen

[Podilarius]

I feel i must bring this up as it has just came to my attention.

NWN2 currently will not be supported by the linux operating system. when they will have support for it is unknown as they have yet to realese a date on it.


thought i would bring that to the table


thanks,
Drakaen

If it comes to that we have options ... Wine is one ... the other is another server we have laying around that has windows running ... It is not as beefy, but I am not going to install Windows on the current machine ...

thanks,
Podilarius

PS. Hopefully they will have Linux support for dedicated server out soon ...
PPS ... We are going to have to have time to work on the mod to get it either ported to NWN2 or redone ... so we shall see.

[atebatsam]

okay, i know this is years later, but after playing on a bunch of different worlds, and playing a lot of pnp too, heres some things i would really like to see for nwn2:

i like the idea of loosing a lvl on respawn, especially after a certain point.  I know i was opposed to in originally, and i think it should be prevented from happening in the first couple of lower lvls, but after- 10 seems like a good lvl- the player should have a general idea of the monsters and areas.  also this really promotes party play (something i've grown to like) and increases the value of heals, buffs, and strategy.  i'm not sure if i agree with automatic loss of lvl, but a % of xp that can drop the pc a lvl.  the only real gripes i have are lag deaths and people shouting for clerics to run across the world to res them when theyre dead.

also, i really liked the reputation system, and was wondering if that could be used for more than just alignment.  while killing good monsters made someone evil, killing challenging monsters gives the pc a more heroic reputaion, giving access to cheaper/more exotic goods, ect.  but maybe it could be used to create factions, like members of the good guild get attacked on sight by members of the evil guild, and i know this was mentioned earlier, i just wanted to second it

something i've found i dislike about persistant worlds is the "start at main town and go to area, then port back to main town" form of adventuring.  i think this world did shy away from that  a lot, with the many many areas, and i think if that was further built upon, that would be pretty cool.  eg:  main quest could be to get from starter town to next town, but a lot of side quests and npcs to be found along the way.  i liked the "openness" of the current mod, which left a lot of room for development, and really see no reason to change it, and just try and further populate the surrounding areas to the towns as time goes on.

lastly, and i know this was something that was being implimented as well, an emphasis on the "ignored" skills and feats in nwn.  too often, theres some fighter/weaponmaster with 20 points cross classed in tumble and spellcraft, which has really been bothering me.  if the fighter heavy skills were in more demand to get fighter based things, people may be reluctent to spend their skill points in things they really have no business spending their skill points on.

anyway, hope to see u all when nwn2 comes out
Justin